UPDATE FROM HMC MULLINS IN IRAQ

[Da-Chief]

HMC Mullins post is below.. If it scares you..

It should.

People, we are in the military! There is no Active Reserve deliniation anymore.. No more 0000 to 8404.. all are being sent.. Are you specialized in Lab, X-ray etc..??

WHO CARES!!! AS HMC Put it before.. It goes like this

1st---Your a SAILOR-- Who believe it or not and contrary to popular belief, we are fighting men and women!!! Ask the sailors who are being trained in MS and SC right now by the ARMY. They are of many rates and being sent IA to the battlefront for a year long hitch..

2nd--- A CORPSMAN!! This is what we do.. We take care of our patients but above all else we follow #1 first!!

3rd--- A TECH!--- Nothing pisses me off more then when a tech whines about deploying.. like they are some prissy Prima-dona.. Please read #1 and #2 above..

Ok off my soapbox. Yeesh.. I even have parents calling me about their kids going to FMSS?? When did we get so lillylivered that "IF IT IS NOT ON PAPER" I don't go..?? When leadership start giving group hugs???

When I joined as a "SPLIT SAM" back in 1984.. I was to go to "Boot-Camp" one summer drill as a Non-designated SN then report back to "HM"A"-SCHOOL for my training then go home, I was then re-routed to FMSS in Camp Pendleton, CA..

Was I scared?? HELL YES?? I DIDN'T JOIN THE MARINES.. but I honored my contract of following the orders of those appointed over me who said.. your going.. so I went..

We are all one force now.. I am sick and tired of hearing the Reserve / Active thing.. We all follow the same rules..

Anyways.. here is HMC Mullins Email.. Take heed ..

HMC Crone


Great to see your sight moving forward. I have been very busy here. I can not tell how much the Corpsman need to focus on head injuries and we have been on the deck for 65 days and have had 39 concussions from IED attacks this is a bloody war still don’t let people say otherwise. Let the young instructors know their jobs are to prepare these kids for 120 temps, less than 6 hours sleep and not the best in culinary choices and keep Marines alive. I saw the topic about OEMS this is simply the best course in Navy Medicine or would not believe the thing that happen and the experience the kids get. I love my job and my corpsman. If anybody does not agree that the focus should be physical fitness and to stress the shit out of the students medically I got some pics that will change their mind.


Ken

[Da-Chief]

All,

This is open for discussion.. I want us all to talk about this.. Spout your views if you want, but understand everyone has an opinion, and theirs may not be the same as yours.. Respect that..

I'll Try..

Heh..

Da-Chief..

[BILLY_SEMPER FI]

My response to this is GEAR UP AND GET READY!!! We all as Corpsman need to get the most realistic training as possible!! Train the way we fight and fight the way we train!! In this day and time we all, Blue and Green side Docs, NEED TO BE HARD CHARGERS!! No Exceptions!! The days of sitting behind a desk for our whole careers is OVER!! Physical Fitness is a must if we are going to keep our Shipmates and Marines alive. Period! I cant wait until I get to go to OEMS!! My mind set is this...It is important to train your mind, body and soul to a pin point of perfection. This will keep you sharp and help keep everyone alive!!



HM3 Frenette

[Da-Chief]

HM3,

Let everyone know what OEMS is.. I know.. but some others may not..

Thanks
HMC

[TheSurgicalTech]

This is my real sentiment and I will not be hypocrite about this. If I knew from the very start that corpsman will servew/ theMarines, I would never, over my dead body enlisted in the Navy. I would maybe, but w/ a different rating.

I felt there was a deceptionfrom the very start. My recruiter never mentioned about FMSS, Marines...To my surprise I only learned the Marine things when I was already in A school. I was so pissed off. I NEVER JOINED THE NAVY TO BE A MARINE ORHAVE ANYTHINGTO DO W/ THEM.Cut that high charger, hurahhh thing.. we were just made to swallow those things because were already into it but I know majority are just afraid to say anything for fear of rejection or criticism.

I could serve my nation w/ same enthusiasm and dedication in the middle of the ocean. My only issue here is that I should have been informed from the very start about serving w/ the Marines as a corpsman. All could have been better if I were only given the information and the opportunity to signafter havingall the information I need to know.

[BILLY_SEMPER FI]

Sorry about that one chief...:) OEMS is "The Operational and Emergency Medical Support (OEMS) Course is a capstone training school for medical support in deployed environments.Developed over the last 12 years, originally for special operations oriented medical officers at the Uniformed Services University, it is now offered as a stand alone school only for DoD and other federal operational personnel.The OEMS Course Mission Statement accurately defines the content. The program consists of 11 days of training (78 hours) including a prolonged field care exercise. Training takes place in various training facilities eight to ten times per year." That is a brief overview. Please look at the website..oems.org. VERY Informative!!!

HM3 F.

[Da-Chief]

Uhh-Rah..

Surgical Tech, no one is going to think less of you for putting down your views.. I appreciate them.. believe me there is a method to my madness.. I am going to invite the MCPON to read these forums.. I want him to see what you all are putting out. Trust me he listens.. I realize there is a problem with Recruiting now.. This is why I wanted this discussion.

Thanks!
Da-Chief..
P.s I am in the scuttlbutt chat area if you want to jump in.. should be in for about 30 mins or so..

out..

[BILLY_SEMPER FI]

I respect your opinion Surg Tech.....Everybody doesn't have the same outlook as I do. It is kind of interesting though because if my recruiter told me I would be aboard ship I would not have been so eager to join the Navy. As soon as I heard about being with the Marine Corps. I said let me in there!!! Either way we are both both doing a great service to our nation.

[buckeyedoc]

Very interesting e-mail. I'm glad you shared. Like Da Chief said, we're all entitled to our opinions. I spent 2 years in the Army infantry. I went back into the Navy Reserves because of 9/11. Being a paramedic, the corpsman was a great opportunity and 8404 was my ticket. I wouldn't do anything else in the Navy. Just my humble opinion.

[oldavt]

I served for 6 years way back when. 4 stateside and 2 deployed on the USS Nimitz. The closest thing to action I saw were the motor whale boat man overboard drills and rescues in Atlantic gales in the winter. My son is now in HCS, hard charging and praying for a Marine billet. He said the only sea duty he would be interested in would be on a tin can as independent duty ;). I'm sure I would have been a much better HM with today's emergency medical training, especially in FMSS. I know he will be better at it than I was.

[andrew]

Chief, can you find out if this is the HMC Mullins is the sameHM2 MullinsI went to PMT School with in 95? If so, Andrew Barrientos says HI!

[Da-Chief]

I'll Pass the word..

Later

HMC

[randver]

my name is HM2(FMF) WHITE. I am a surgical tech. just got back from Iraq where I was part of an 8 man surgical team in Ramadi Iraq, where I was on duty 24/7 for 7 months. I think the best thing we could do for new corpsman is get them some time in a major trauma ER. so they can see gun shots and burns. one of the things people have not been saying about the IEDs is that they are now putting propane and kerosene with them so if the explosion does not kill you the fireball will. but no matter what we do we will never be able to get are boys ready to see there friends look like crispy critter yet still screaming and alive. we fond for most extremity wounds from vbieds, ieds, and gunshots it was best to just put them in a tourniquet and get them back to us at the level 2. I will try to answer any questions to the best of my ability, as one of 2 surg techs on the base i was not aloud to leave the base so i don’t know what its like on the street i just know what the aftermath looks like and it ant pretty.

[HMSteen]

edited

[Navy Nerd]

Mornin' all. I just want to throw my two cents in. I am a 34 year old father of three boys that is happily married and has a great career. I've posted here many times and I'm sure some of you know my story already. Anyway, to the point......I came into the Navy with only one goal....to be a "Devil Doc". I love the Navy, but I love my Marines even more. As a Paramedic for 13 years, I NEVER got the respect or appreciation for what I am good at until I made it to the 3/25th. I am good at what I do, and they know that I will go above and beyond for them as they would for me. BUT, that's me! If you are a Corpsman, then your my brother or my sister. It does not matter to me if you are on a ship, a field hospital, an OR, or with the Corps. You are part of the greatest organization the United States military has ever had, and should be proud of that. You are NO LESS of a Corpsman because you didn't come in to serve with the Marines. Unfortunately, some Recruiters out there don't do their job. However, we all signed on the dotted line and you have to take some responsibility for reading your contract and knowing what you are signing up for. And to agree with Da Chief.......WE are in the United States Military and WE ARE at war. So, to those whiners....suck it up and do your job. To the rest of you....God Bless you ALL and stay safe.

Semper Fi

Doc Hollister

[DOC_Newt]

Chief,

You make a good point when you talk about all the bitching when it comes to things being "on paper" as far as FMSS. When I joined I was told nothing about the "green side" until I arrived at HM A school, and at first I was pissed, but then I started to think to myself "that looks like a good way to challenge myself", which is one of the reasons I had joined the Navy. After I did a 2 year tour at NNMC I was off to Camp Lejuene, N.C. for FMSS then Hawaii for a 3 year tour with the Marines, division not group, whenI arrived I had confidence and knowledge, but I was still wet behind the ears and did not know what to expect, but I quickly went from being a "squid" to "Doc" and haven't looked back. My point is to look at a tour with the Marines as an opportunity to grow as a Corpsman and as a Person, not a punishment.

HM3(FMF) Newton

[A.R. Gomez]

I am a Lab tech stationed at Camp Pendleton with orders to detach with 2/5 in march to go to Ramadi. I recently found out I am leaving my POG job in the hospital to go with division so this topic is something i think about often lately. I guess I can understand the feelings of those techs who don't think it fair to be sent out to do any other job than that of a tech. I myself don't find it to be very cost effective to spend money training someone to be a tech and then pull them from a job few people can do to go greenside, especially when we have all these NCS corpsman who seem to only be sigining up to get sent with the greenside anyway. Cost effectiveness aside, I think those techs should suck it up. No one ever said that once you become a tech you are exempt from all work not related to your respective specialty. If anyone led you to believe such a thing then shame on them for doing so. Ever since the day I checked in to my command everyone else told me, "You will be the next to go greenside, so get ready." Almost every male in my department has gone and some of the females. I'm on the fleet hospital platform and they still called my name for division. if a tech has a problem being in the military and doing any other job than their specialty my words to you are GO TO THE ARMY. I strongly suggest those people talk to someone about a blue to green program and see what it can offer them. In regards to those who joined during a time of war and are so scared of field med or a possible trip to the green side... you people should have done some homework before you signed the line instead of just taking whatever a recruiter (who was probably a store keeper or something) tells you about this job for face value. To all those who are playing the poor me card about a green side deployment, spare me. Don't think you're the first. Same thing has been happening for years, matter of fact it happened to Doc Bradley when they pulled him out of a hospital in Oakland, and he ended up holding on to a flag on a little island called Iwo Jima!

[DevilDoc]

I just want to point out, the reason that most people don't know what they are getting into with the whole Corpsman/Marines thing, can not necessarily be pinned on the recruiters entirely. Yes, they should tell you these things, but you should also ask as many questions as you can. I didn't know until I asked, what the role of a Corpsman was. I researched all branches of the military before making a decision. I knew I wanted to be a medic somewhere, having worked in EMS on a 911 ambu. for a few years, trauma was the thing I loved. My recruiter told me that by joining the Navy, I could be a "Doc" for the Marines. When I heard this, there was nothing else I wanted to do. But I asked all the questions that got me the answers I needed. The problem, I think is that people forget to ask questions and make decisions with out all the information at hand. Whether you think you will serving on a ship or on land, bottom line is, you signed the contract. You joined the military, you took an oath to serve and protect your country and countrymen. This means that in a time of war, it's your duty to stand behind your word, whether you like it or not. The war can find you, no matter where you are. Remember the guys who perished on the Cole...or those who were in Pearl Harbor. A great number of Sailors have died, who were not on land and who were not even in hostile territory. Using the excuse that you wouldn't join the Navy if you knew that you would be serving with Marines, is a lot of whining B.S. The Marine Corps is a Department of the Navy. If you didn't know that, then you didn't do your research, and shame on you for jumping in the water without knowing how deep it is.

As far as FMSS goes, it in no way prepares Corpsman for war. They definately need something that will better prepare them for trauma cases. OEMS is a good school, but good luck getting into it. I have tried to get several Docs in my unit into this school and the Navy keeps saying that it's to expensive to send them. So the $2500 to send one Doc to this school, apparently seems like to much to invest, even though the training is invaluable and could mean the difference between the number of lives we save on the battlefield, apparently is to much for Uncle Sam to choke back. Nice to know what they think of the value of the lives of our Marines and Sailors, huh? I am the training petty officer in my unit and I have tried going up as high as the XO and CO of the Battalion, and they couldn't even get the funding approved for this. So if the Chief here has any suggestions to get my Sailors into this school, it's greatly appreciated.

Doc Hollister, glad to here you made it back from FMSS. We have spoke in the past. How you liking 3/25? Or is it2/25 your with? Some guys that used to be in my unit went to 2/25, then deployed within 2 months of the transfer. They will coming home soon.

Best of luck to everyone. Sempre Fi.

DevilDoc

[Da-Chief]

Shipmate,

Good post.. passing it around Corps School right now. ;-)


On OEMS.. Problem is your with MARFORRES.. Funding for reserves are always short. They need it for the people who are on A/D right now. I realize what you said about getting your guys ready, but our A/D are deploying twice as much as the Reserves and that is where the money is being spent.

I would get in touch with the CMC for MARFORRES I believe it is Master Chief Light? And ask him.. you always have the ablility to call him. Do so..

V/R
HMC

[DevilDoc]

Thanks Chief, I will try getting in touch with CMC Light. Although I know CDR Bacher (XO for 4MedBn SCOB, that's us) did her best to get funding for this. A few guys I know got mobilized and sent over to Iraq, wanted OEMS, but weren't sent there. In fact, one of my boys was with HM2 Walsh when he was killed. These guys tell me that they were in no way prepared medically for what they are going through. Being with the grunts, the training they got before going over was the same training given to riflemen, and when they tried to get things for their Marines medically from the BAS, the Doc's in the BAS gave them a hard time and treated them like shit. So all in all, they are getting the raw end of the deal, but still they are sucking it up and doing thier jobs.

I feel fortunate that I worked in EMS for a long time and saw a great many gun shot wounds and burn victims, etc. I feel like I have a good grasp on how to handle these injuries. It's of course harder to deal with when they are your fellow Marines and Sailors, so that being said, imagine seeing these things and not having had a lot of exposure to these type of injuries. They really do need to allocate more funding for this sort of training for ALL the Corpsman. Every single one, except the newbies, have been deployed from my unit. Not one of them got OEMS. And as it's turning out, the Reserves are doing the longer tours over there on average. They want us to be fully integrated and ready to support, but bottom line is, we are not. A huge number of Reservists are clueless. Hate to say it, but I am here and I see it first hand.

We do have a Leadership Conf. next weekend with all of 4MedBn SCOB's high ranking officers and select enlisted, so I will take advantage and see if I can get some answers on funding for training such as OEMS. Thanks again Chief.

Sempre Fi,

DevilDoc

[PrairieSon]

When I joined in 79I never gave it much thought as to where I would be serving. My dad, older brother, four uncles, and others all went in the Navy. Back then, (not that it's that long ago) if you couldn't afford college you went in the service. At least in my family, we couldn't afford college. I will say this, the recruiter didn't go out of his way to mention I could end up with the Marine Corps without any say in it. I suppose I could blame him or blame myself for not doing my "homework". I didn't see it as a problem then, I don't see it as a problem now. (For me)

I ended up going from L&D at NavHosp to FMF in Beirut all inmy first enlistment. That's quite a difference!You just do what you do. You do what they need you to do. Ooh-Ra.

[HMC-FMF-PJ]

I have some free time & feeling crankythis morning so you're all in trouble... ;-)

=== focus on head injuries

Corpsmen need to violently insist that all safety gear is worn at all times while within firing range of enemy forces to help minimize their workload. (It is a hell of a lot easier to yell at a Marine to put his helmet on than it is wash his brains off the wall.) However, the current emphasis on head injuries involves blunt trauma, not penetrating trauma. Everyone knows to evac the Marine with blood leaking out their skull, but not many think to evac the Marine who is vomiting after knocking his grape. Reports from the field indicate that Corpsman and Marine Leaders need to brush up on signs & symptom of internal head injuries (concussion, intracranial hematoma, brain contusion, fracture, etc.) When there is a direct blow, violent shaking, or a whiplash-type injury, the bruising of the brain and the damage to the internal tissue and blood vessels needs to be recognized and diagnosed as soon as possible.

=== I felt there was a deception from the very start. My recruiter never mentioned... My only issue here is that I should have been informed from the very start about serving w/ the Marines as a corpsman. All could have been better if I were only given the information and the opportunity to sign after having all the information I need to know.

If you are that upset about it then put in for an inter-service transfer. However, all the information was readily available from multiple sources and it is fairly common knowledge for anyone that knows anything about Corpsmen or the Marine Corps. You are an adult and you negotiated a legal contract. If the Recruiter lied, that is one thing and that would be totally unacceptable but I don't think that is what happened. If you failed to do your homework, if you failed to ask the question, or if you failed to read the contract’s fine print -- then my dear friend YOU are to blame for your ignorance and misunderstanding. Who are you going to blame when it comes time to buy a house, get married, or have a kid? No one should have to spoon-feed you the facts of life. You're a big boy now and as an adult you bear all the responsibility & liability whenever you sign your name.


=== Operational and Emergency Medical Support (OEMS) Course

http://www.corpsman.com/wowbb/view_topic.php?id=132&forum_id=2



===Uhh-Rah.. Surgical Tech, no one is going to think less of you for putting down your views..

Please understand. I do not think less of you for misunderstanding the job you applied for and accepted. Hopefully you and everyone reading has learned a lesson that as an adult you need to do your homework before entering into a binding contract. I don't care if it is the Boot Camp graduate who finally has a steady paycheck and goes to spend $30,000 on a $15,000 car ---- the 3rd Class going to a pay day loan shop to borrow $50 only to repay $200 ---- the Reservist who signs away all treatment benefits by stating he is healthy because he thinks it will get him home faster than if he admits his injury --- or the warrior that doesn't update his paperwork and leaves all his benefits to an old ex-girlfriend you know he hated.

Guess what boys & girls, you are adults now and your signature can carry incredible power to screw up your life and the life of your loved ones if you don't do things right.



=== no matter what we do we will never be able to get are boys ready to see there friends (injured)

Actually realistic training and trauma rotations as you suggested do a whole lot of good towards getting them ready. I think our training programs do a good job getting Doc ready for the initial incident & response; however, I think we need to vastly improve our training in order to help him be ready for the post-event quiet time when the adrenaline is gone. We also need to ensure Corpsmen & leaders can recognize the stress and know what to do.


===I am not mad at the forgien fighters or Iraqis that are putting up a struggle. just wish the would man up and fight us str8.

First off, please review DoD Directive 1325.6 for guidance. Next, why don't our pilots and UCAV operators "man up"? Why do our SpecOps teams employ ambushes and hit-&-run tactics? Are they cowards? No.

I believe the quote is: "Those Who Do Not Learn From History Are Doomed To Repeat It"

Please read this article and see if what the insurgents are doing is in any way all that different from what the NVA did. ("rocket raid rules")
http://www.gruntonline.com/TheWar/Tactics/tactics7.htm

But then some called the NVA cowardly too. What about Rogers’ Rangers during the French-Indian War? You sound like a British Red Coat complaining about the damn cowardly colonialist taking cheap pot shots while hiding behind tree's during the American Revolution. Give a read to "Treatise on Partisan Warfare" (1789) if you want to know more about that.

In general, the enemy is not cowardly or stupid. Many are extremely intelligent and very determined. The enemy is simply using a tactic that favors their situation and they are forcing us to fight on their terms. Unfortunately their measure of success is much lower than ours and thus so is their job. This is a high stakes chess match gentlemen and we need to use our brain housing group to enable us to fight on our terms without creating new enemies or things will go badly. You need to switch your primary interest from entertainment to knowledge. Football, TV, & PlayStation won't keep anyone alive in combat.

But hey, the Romans voiced the same complaint when the British and Germanic tribes elected to fight within the forest instead of simply being slaughtered by the legionaries on the open ground.


===I guess I can understand the feelings of those techs who don't think it fair to be sent out to do any other job than that of a tech. I myself don't find it to be very cost effective to spend money training someone to be a tech and then pull them from a job few people can do to go greenside,

Can you understand the feelings of the 8404's who have already done 2, 3, or 4 deployments and would like to take a break?

I don't know if you'll get one with Division, but there are forward deployed tech positions that need to be filled too. And even if you take a grunt 8404 slot for a tour, it is much cheaper to send you in for 8-months and allow us to retain a HM that otherwise would have burned out and left the Navy.

Your 12 months away from a microscope is much more cost effective than recruiting a boot with a $20k bonus, providing 8 months initial training (RTC, HM, FMSS), then another 3-10 month work-up with the Marines prior to deployment, and then his actual deployment.

I do like your "suck it up" and "shame on them" beliefs though. BTW, Doc Bradley participated in BOTH flag raisings on Mt Suribachi; the 1st & the famous (2nd). I don't think any of the Marines did both, but I'm not sure. I have fun harassing Marines when (1) they don't know a Doc is there, & (2) they don't know which one is the Doc (the only man with his face visible)

=== The Marine Corps is a Department of the Navy. As far as FMSS goes, it in no way prepares Corpsman for war. They definately need something that will better prepare them for trauma cases. OEMS is a good school, but good luck getting into it.

It will soon be the "Department of the Navy and Marine Corps (http://www.dnmc.us/Set.htm)"
http://www.dnmc.us/Set.htm

On 26 April 2006, Senior Enlisted Marine Corps Leaders and other subject matter experts met in Camp Lejeune, to conduct a Zero Base Review (ZBR) of HM “A” and Field Medical Service School curriculums as they related to MCO P3500.75. During this review, the group used the level 1000 Individual Training Standards (ITS) as its basis and after the ZBR was completed the group reviewed issues as they related to sustaining and improving training effectiveness and curriculum standardization. The following are the findings of this ZBR with recommended actions needed to ensure the Hospital Corps has the combat and medical competencies and skills required to fulfill the full spectrum of current and foreseeable future missions. ...... ·Tactical Combat Casualty Care (TCCC) “like” competencies including live tissue experience in hemorrhage control using clotting agents and suture techniques.

We have managed to get OEMS funding several times, but the last two got shot down at the last minute. They seemed to want the course completion date and deployment date to be closer together, but I could be wrong. However it is my understanding that OEMS basically came from NSHS San Diego and went to the private world. I think a better long-term solution is to reinstitute the training within the Navy. NSHS or FMSS should be hosting military run classes like OEMS.


=====when they tried to get things for their Marines medically from the BAS, the Doc's in the BAS gave them a hard time and treated them like shit.

Teach your Corpsmen to properly employ the chain of command. As an HM1, I was shot down and shut out by the BAS HMCS until I brought the matter up through the chain of command and presented my argument in a professional and compelling manner. I'm not saying the HMCS didn't have his reasons, but after the CAPT (O6) instructed him to give me what I needed, I rarely ran into trouble with the BAS. Teach them how & when to use the unit's internal chain of command and the exterior supporting chains. Encourage them to be proactive and resourceful within the established guidelines (ie. When the MarDiv took all the morphine, I got mine from the British) And instead of empire building, hoarding, & FUJIGM -- network and foster an atmosphere of cooperation with other Doc's (unit, clinic, hosp, ship, etc.) The end goal is to take care of our warriors and get them home in the best condition possible.


====A huge number of Reservists are clueless. Hate to say it, but I am here and I see it first hand.


I feel your pain and understand the situation. Another problem is that the Doc's are so busy supporting Marine training and Marine requirements, that the Corpsmen are hardly ever able to get any medical training or take care of Navy requirements.

However, you have 12 ATP and usually a chance of 2nd AT you can use for training. You may also need to fight for time dedicated to medical training. And if you are the SME, then you need to teach them until they have a clue. If you are not doing it already, have them give classes to each other & the Marines. Studying to prepare for the class and the instructor experience will help keep them familiar with the info. Even if it just a bunch of basic 10-minute hip-pocket classes that they repeat every couple drills. It will develop the Marines' buddy aid and help the Doc. Work buddy aid casualty drills into the training. Something as simple as tossing a Marine a CAT and telling him his buddy's thigh just got hit or walking up to a Cpl and ask "what do you need to do to request a CASEVAC?" -- especially during the Marines' LandNav and Comm training.

[HMSteen]

D. POLICY
It is DoD policy that a member of the Armed Forces (hereafter referred to as "member") is encouraged to carry out the obligations of a citizen. While on AD, however, members are prohibited from engaging in certain political activities. Subject to the guidelines in enclosure 3, the following DoD policy shall apply:
1. General


a. A member on AD may:


(1) Register, vote, and express his or her personal opinion on political candidates and issues, but not as a representative of the Armed Forces.


(2) Make monetary contributions to a political organization-


(3) Attend partisan and nonpartisan political meetings or rallies as a spectator when not in uniform.


b. A member on AD shall not:


(1) Use his or her official authority or influence for interfering with an election; affecting the course or outcome of an election; soliciting votes for a particular candidate or issue; or requiring or soliciting political contributions from others.


(2) Be a candidate for, or hold, civil office except as authorized in subsections D.2. and D.3., below.


(3) Participate in partisan political management, campaigns, or conventions.


(4) Make campaign contributions to another r of the Armed Forces or an employee of the Federal Government.


c. To assist in applying paragraphs D.1-a- and D.l.b., above, to particular situations, enclosure 3 provides guidelines and examples of permissible and prohibited political activities. The guidelines in enclosure 3 do not supersede other specific requirements and policies, such as those established in DoD Directives 5200.2 and 1325.6 (references (c) and (d)).


d. Enclosure 4 provides a summary of Federal statutes restricting certain types of political activities by members of the Armed Forces.
Reviewed.

[HMSteen]

http://www.dod.mil/dodgc/defense_ethics/ethics_regulation/1344-10.html



I think this is what HMC FMF PJ was talking about.

[HMSteen]

====You need to switch your primary interest from entertainment to knowledge. Football, TV, & PlayStation won't keep anyone alive in combat.



Been there 3 times already. Still alive. I love football, TV, and not playstation.

==== Next, why don't our pilots and UCAV operators "man up"? Why do our SpecOps teams employ ambushes and hit-&-run tactics? Are they cowards? No.

I believe the quote is: "Those Who Do Not Learn From History Are Doomed To Repeat It"

Please read this article and see if what the insurgents are doing in any thing all that different from what the NVA did. ("rocket raid rules")
http://www.gruntonline.com/TheWar/Tactics/tactics7.htm

But then some called the NVA cowardly too. What about Rogers’ Rangers during the French-Indian War? You sound like a British Red Coat complaining about the damn cowardly colonialist taking cheap pot shots while hiding behind tree's during the American Revolution. Give a read to "Treatise on Partisan Warfare" (1789) if you want to know more about that.

In general, the enemy is not cowardly or stupid. Many are extremely intelligent and very determined. The enemy is simply using a tactic that favors their situation and they are forcing us to fight on their terms. Unfortunately their measure of success is much lower than ours and thus so is their job. This is a high stakes chess match gentlemen and we need to use our brain housing group to enable us to fight on our terms without creating new enemies or things will go badly. You need to switch your primary interest from entertainment to knowledge. Football, TV, & PlayStation won't keep anyone alive in combat.

But hey, the Romans voiced the same complaint when the British and Germanic tribes elected to fight within the forest instead of simply being slaughtered by the legionaries on the open ground.




Iwasnt talking about the road side bombs and things of that nature I was talking about hiding behind women and children. Killing innocent people thats what i was refering to.

[randver]

HMC-FMF-PJ wrote: === focus on head injuries

Corpsmen need to violently insist that all safety gear is worn at all times while within firing range of enemy forces to help minimize their workload. (It is a hell of a lot easier to yell at a Marine to put his helmet on than it is wash his brains off the wall.) However, the current emphasis on head injuries involves blunt trauma, not penetrating trauma. Everyone knows to evac the Marine with blood leaking out their skull, but not many think to evac the Marine who is vomiting after knocking his grape. Reports from the field indicate that Corpsman and Marine Leaders need to brush up on signs & symptom of internal head injuries (concussion, intracranial hematoma, brain contusion, fracture, etc.) When there is a direct blow, violent shaking, or a whiplash-type injury, the bruising of the brain and the damage to the internal tissue and blood vessels needs to be recognized and diagnosed as soon as possible.
·Tactical Combat Casualty Care (TCCC) “like” competencies including live tissue experience in hemorrhage control using clotting agents and suture techniques.


not picking on you just adding my 2cents


I just left Ramadi Iraq. while I was there we had a rule where any one (marine, soldier or sailor) that was in or near a blast had to come in and get looked at even if they appeared to have no injuries

As an OR tech i can say, any suturing done at a BAS level should only be to superficial wounds. or you can do way more harm then good.

And as far as clotting agents quickclot should be thrown away and not used! more then once we had marine and soldiers come in with partially amputated knees that we could have saved and they would have a normal knee afterwards, but quickclot was purred in to the wound to stop the bleeding. the quickclot destroyed there meniscus and burned other ligaments that other wise where still intact or reparable. they ended up with ether an AKA (above knee amputation) or with a fused knee, do to the quickclot and not the initial injury. The only time it should be used is if they have an arterial bleed high up in the groin area where you can not get a tourniquet on it.

One thing we really need to work on is teaching the all corpsman how to better watch out for s/s of PTSD in them selves and in there boys. and how to help there boys deal with it. one of my best friends is a marine sgt that I had to force to get help before for his PTSD. I did not even know he had it since he was to macho to say anything was wrong tell one day he got drunk had a flash back and tried to kill me. after he started getting help he got in front of his company and talked about what happen and how he is getting better. once the junior marine saw that one of there leaders was having problems too and that there was nothing wrong with asking for help about 10% of them admitted they where having problems and started getting help too.



As far as techs going with the grunts. i spent 7yrs with the grunts before i went to OR school and wish i could go over with my boys (grunts) and not with MLG
not picking on you just adding my 2cents

[Da-Chief]

Well here is DoD Directive 1325.6.. Educate yourselves.. I should have had this on here before..

Da-Chief..








Department of Defense[/font]]





DIRECTIVE[/font]]



NUMBER 1325.6
October 1, 1996
Certified Current as of December 1, 2003









USD(P&R)[/font]]
SUBJECT: Guidelines for Handling Dissident and Protest Activities Among Members of the Armed Forces

References:(a) DoD Directive 1325.6, subject as above, September 12, 1969 (hereby canceled)

(b) Chapter 47 of title 10, United States Code, "Uniform Code of Military Justice"

(c) Title 18, United States Code

(d) DoD Directive 1334.1, "Wearing of the Uniform," August 11, 1969

(e) Title 10, United States Code



1. REISSUANCE AND PURPOSE

This Directive reissues reference (a) to update DoD policy and responsibilities governing the handling of dissident activities by members of the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marine Corps. Specific problems should be resolved only on the basis of the particular facts of the situation and in accordance with the provisions of applicable DoD regulations and reference (b).



2. APPLICABILITY

This Directive applies to the Office of the Secretary of Defense, the Military Departments (including the Coast Guard when it is operating as a Military Service in the Navy), the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the Combatant Commands, the Defense Agencies, and the DoD Field Activities (hereafter referred to collectively as "the DoD Components"). The term "Military Services," as used herein, refers to the Army, the Navy, the Air Force, and the Marine Corps.





3. POLICY

It is DoD policy that:

3.1. The Department of Defense shall safeguard the security of the United States.

3.2. The Service members' right of expression should be preserved to the maximum extent possible, consistent with good order and discipline and the national security.

3.3. No commander should be indifferent to conduct that, if allowed to proceed unchecked, would destroy the effectiveness of his or her unit.

3.4. The proper balancing of these interests will depend largely upon the calm and prudent judgment of the responsible commander.

3.5. The following guidelines be applied to principal activities that the Armed Forces have encountered:

3.5.1. Possession and Distribution of Printed Materials

3.5.1.1. A commander is not authorized to prohibit the distribution of a specific issue of a publication distributed through official outlets such as post exchanges and military libraries. In the case of distribution of publications through other than official outlets, commanders may require that prior approval be obtained for any distribution on a military installation to determine whether there is a clear danger to the loyalty, discipline, or morale of military personnel, or if the distribution of the publication would materially interfere with the accomplishment of a military mission. Distribution of any publication determined to be a danger in any of these areas shall be prohibited.

3.5.1.2. While the mere possession of unauthorized printed material may not be prohibited, printed material that is prohibited from distribution shall be impounded if the commander determines that an attempt will be made to distribute.

3.5.1.3. The fact that a publication is critical of government policies or officials is not, in itself, a ground on which distribution may be prohibited.

3.5.2. Off-Post Gathering Places. Commanders have the authority to place establishments "off-limits" in accordance with established procedures when, for example, the activities taking place there include counseling members to refuse to perform duty or to desert; pose a significant adverse effect on Service members' health, morale, or welfare; or otherwise present a clear danger to the loyalty, discipline, or morale of a member or military unit.

3.5.3. Servicemen Organizations. Commanders are not authorized to recognize or to bargain with any union representing or seeking recognition to represent Service members.

3.5.4. Publication of "Underground Newspapers." Personal writing for publication may not be pursued during duty hours, or accomplished by the use of Government or non-appropriated fund property on- or off-duty. While publication of "underground newspapers" by military personnel off-post, on their own time, and with their own money and equipment, is not prohibited, if such a publication contains language the utterance of which is punishable under Federal law, those involved in the printing, publication, or distribution may be disciplined for such infractions.

3.5.5. On-Post Demonstrations and Similar Activities. The commander of a military installation or other military controlled facility under the jurisdiction of the United States shall prohibit any demonstration or activity on the installation or facility that could result in interference with or prevention of orderly accomplishment of the mission of the installation or facility, or present a clear danger to loyalty, discipline, or morale of the troops. It is a crime for any person to enter a military reservation for any purpose prohibited by law or lawful regulations, or for any person to enter or re-enter an installation after having been barred by order of the commander under 18 U.S.C. 1382 (reference (c)).

3.5.6. Off-Post Demonstrations by Members. Members of the Armed Forces are prohibited from participating in off-post demonstrations when they are on-duty, in a foreign country, when their activities constitute a breach of law and order, when violence is likely to result, or when they are in uniform in violation of DoD Directive 1334.1 (reference (d)).

3.5.7. Grievances. The right of members to complain and request redress of grievances against actions of their commanders is protected by Article 138 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (reference (b)). In addition, a member may petition or present any grievance to any Member of Congress or an Inspector General under 10 U.S.C. 1034 (reference (e)). An open door policy for complaints is a basic principle of good leadership, and commanders should personally ensure that adequate procedures exist for identifying valid complaints and taking corrective action.

3.5.8. Prohibited Activities. Military personnel must reject participation in organizations that espouse supremacist causes; attempt to create illegal discrimination based on race, creed, color, sex, religion, or national origin; advocate the use of force or violence; or otherwise engage in efforts to deprive individuals of their civil rights. Active participation, such as publicly demonstrating or rallying, fund raising, recruiting and training members, organizing or leading such organizations, or otherwise engaging in activities in relation to such organizations or in furtherance of the objectives of such organizations that are viewed by command to be detrimental to the good order, discipline, or mission accomplishment of the unit, is incompatible with Military Service, and is, therefore, prohibited. Commanders have authority to employ the full range of administrative procedures, including separation or appropriate disciplinary action, against military personnel who actively participate in such groups. Functions of command include vigilance about the existence of such activities; active use of investigative authority to include a prompt and fair complaint process; and use of administrative powers, such as counseling, reprimands, orders, and performance evaluations to deter such activities. Military Departments shall ensure that this policy on prohibited activities is included in initial active duty training, pre-commissioning training, professional military education, commander training, and other appropriate Service training programs.



4. RESPONSIBILITIES

4.1. The Under Secretary of Defense for Personnel and Readiness shall:

4.1.1. Develop overall policy and guidelines for handling dissident and protest activities among members of the Armed Forces.

4.1.2. Approve policies and procedures developed by the Secretaries of the Military Departments that implement this Directive.

4.2. The Secretaries of the Military Departments shall:

4.2.1. Establish policies and procedures to implement this Directive within their respective Departments.

4.2.2. Ensure compliance with the training requirements set out in subparagraph 3.5.8., above.



5. EFFECTIVE DATE

This Directive is effective immediately.


Enclosures - 1

E1. Constitutional and Statutory Provisions Relevant to Handling of Dissident and Protest Activities in the Armed Forces



E1. ENCLOSURE 1
CONSTITUTIONAL AND STATUTORY PROVISIONS RELEVANT TO HANDLING OF DISSIDENT AND PROTEST ACTIVITIES IN THE ARMED FORCES


E1.1. CONSTITUTION

The First Amendment, U.S. Constitution, provides as follows:

Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.



E1.2. STATUTORY PROVISIONS

E1.2.1. Applicable to All Persons

E1.2.1.1. 18 U.S.C. Section 1381, reference (c) -- Enticing desertion and harboring deserters.

E1.2.1.2. Section 2385 -- Advocating overthrow of the Government.

E1.2.1.3. Section 2387 -- Counseling insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty.

E1.2.1.4. Section 2388 -- Causing or attempting to cause insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty during war.

E1.2.2. Applicable to Members of the Armed Forces

E1.2.2.1. 10 U.S.C. Section 917, reference (e), (Article 117, UCMJ) -- Provoking speeches or gestures.

E1.2.2.2. Section 882 (Article 82, UCMJ) -- Soliciting desertion, mutiny, sedition, or misbehavior before the enemy.

E1.2.2.3. Section 904 (Article 104, UCMJ) -- Aiding the enemy.

E1.2.2.4. Section 901 (Article 101, UCMJ) -- Improper use of a countersign.

E1.2.2.5. Section 888 (Article 88, UCMJ) -- Contemptuous words by commissioned officers against certain officials.

E1.2.2.6. Section 889 (Article 89, UCMJ) -- Disrespect toward a superior commissioned officer.

E1.2.2.7. Section 891 (Article 91, UCMJ) -- Insubordinate conduct toward a warrant officer, noncommissioned officer, or petty officer.

E1.2.2.8. Section 892 (Article 92, UCMJ) -- Failure to obey order or regulation.

E1.2.2.9. Section 934 (Article 134, UCMJ) -- Uttering disloyal statement, criminal libel, communicating a threat, and soliciting another to commit an offense.

[Da-Chief]

HMC-FMF-PJ wrote: I have some free time & feeling crankythis morning so you're all in trouble... ;-)Good we need some discussion.. You think your cranky.. I have duty tomorrow..;-)

=== focus on head injuries

Corpsmen need to violently insist that all safety gear is worn at all times while within firing range of enemy forces to help minimize their workload. (It is a hell of a lot easier to yell at a Marine to put his helmet on than it is wash his brains off the wall.) However, the current emphasis on head injuries involves blunt trauma, not penetrating trauma. Everyone knows to evac the Marine with blood leaking out their skull, but not many think to evac the Marine who is vomiting after knocking his grape. Reports from the field indicate that Corpsman and Marine Leaders need to brush up on signs & symptom of internal head injuries (concussion, intracranial hematoma, brain contusion, fracture, etc.) When there is a direct blow, violent shaking, or a whiplash-type injury, the bruising of the brain and the damage to the internal tissue and blood vessels needs to be recognized and diagnosed as soon as possible.This is so true.. HMC Mullins put this in his email about all the closed head trauma... We need to adapt and over come, the enemy is..

=== I felt there was a deception from the very start. My recruiter never mentioned... My only issue here is that I should have been informed from the very start about serving w/ the Marines as a corpsman. All could have been better if I were only given the information and the opportunity to sign after having all the information I need to know.

If you are that upset about it then put in for an inter-service transfer. However, all the information was readily available from multiple sources and it is fairly common knowledge for anyone that knows anything about Corpsmen or the Marine Corps. You are an adult and you negotiated a legal contract. If the Recruiter lied, that is one thing and that would be totally unacceptable but I don't think that is what happened. If you failed to do your homework, if you failed to ask the question, or if you failed to read the contract’s fine print -- then my dear friend YOU are to blame for your ignorance and misunderstanding. Who are you going to blame when it comes time to buy a house, get married, or have a kid? No one should have to spoon-feed you the facts of life. You're a big boy now and as an adult you bear all the responsibility & liability whenever you sign your name.
Well I want to educate you all on what is happening with recruiting.. 1. NCS, Recrutiters are telling recruits this is the fastest way to get in, no waiting and you can "EXTEND for 24 MONTHS THEN REENLIST" on active duty when you are done with your initial 15 months. Folks this could not be further from the truth. Are the recruiters lying......????Nope.. If you were to look at the Recruiting Manual and then look at the MILPERSMAN, it does indeed state that you can do those things, Unfortunately NAVADMINS have been sent out stressing up the program since NCS is a RESERVE PIPELINE ... The Reserves are paying for these seats but eveyone wanted to stay on A/D.. I have spoke to several CPO's at MEP'S Stations who openly admit they told recruits they could stay on active duty then pick up the GI bill when they extend.. BECAUSE IT WAS IN BLACK AND WHITE in their recruiting manual and in the MILPERSMAN.. One hand didn't know what the other was doing.. Recruiters were not lying, but they are brought up as the scapegoat.Truth be told, the rectuiters don't even write the contracts anymore.. MEPS does them all.. Can't even blame the recruiters anymore.. :shock:

It will soon be the "Department of the Navy and Marine Corps (http://www.dnmc.us/Set.htm)"
http://www.dnmc.us/Set.htm

On 26 April 2006, Senior Enlisted Marine Corps Leaders and other subject matter experts met in Camp Lejeune, to conduct a Zero Base Review (ZBR) of HM “A” and Field Medical Service School curriculums as they related to MCO P3500.75. During this review, the group used the level 1000 Individual Training Standards (ITS) as its basis and after the ZBR was completed the group reviewed issues as they related to sustaining and improving training effectiveness and curriculum standardization. The following are the findings of this ZBR with recommended actions needed to ensure the Hospital Corps has the combat and medical competencies and skills required to fulfill the full spectrum of current and foreseeable future missions. ...... ·Tactical Combat Casualty Care (TCCC) “like” competencies including live tissue experience in hemorrhage control using clotting agents and suture techniques.

We have managed to get OEMS funding several times, but the last two got shot down at the last minute. They seemed to want the course completion date and deployment date to be closer together, but I could be wrong. However it is my understanding that OEMS basically came from NSHS San Diego and went to the private world. I think a better long-term solution is to reinstitute the training within the Navy. NSHS or FMSS should be hosting military run classes like this.


I hope this happens.. I know having worked in Curriculum here at NHCS, that a bunch of proposals come in but none get acted on.. Seems we just buy more computers.. I have yet to see a Medical School teach online yet though.. :?=====when they tried to get things for their Marines medically from the BAS, the Doc's in the BAS gave them a hard time and treated them like shit.

Teach your Corpsmen to properly employ the chain of command. As an HM1, I was shot down and shut out by the BAS HMCS until I brought the matter up through the chain of command and presented my argument in a professional and compelling manner. I'm not saying the HMCS didn't have his reasons, but after the CAPT (O6) instructed him to give me what I needed, I rarely ran into trouble with the BAS. Teach them how & when to use the unit's internal chain of command and the exterior supporting chains. Encourage them to be proactive and resourceful within the established guidelines (ie. When the MarDiv took all the morphine, I got mine from the British) And instead of empire building, hoarding, & FUJIGM -- network and foster an atmosphere of cooperation with other Doc's (unit, clinic, hosp, ship, etc.) The end goal is to take care of our warriors and get them home in the best condition possible.I cannot stress what was written above.. Start your own lines of communication and supply. There are ways to get what you want when you need if above board if you share as much as you use.. I.e if somone helps me out and supplies me with stuff I need but don't have, When it is his/her turn needing it be the first to offer as long as it doesn't put you mission at risk.. BURNED my ass when I would walk into another unit in the rear and they would have stock up the whazzo.. I needed stuff by the "KING"wouldn't give it up.. Heres' one for you.. Came into a BAS in the rear.. Dragging my Marines out of the field to get seen, Walk in, A/C is blowing on all the Nurses and doc's in thier spaces, The Marines wern't getting any.. When I saw the Regimental Doc later that night I admired to him how nice it was for his BAS Personel to "TEST" the A/C Prior to anyone using, and really admired how they did it 24/7... Suffice it to say, the next day when I went by.. The blower had been moved.. :dude:


====A huge number of Reservists are clueless. Hate to say it, but I am here and I see it first hand.


I feel your pain and understand the situation. Another problem is that the Doc's are so busy supporting Marine training and Marine requirements, that the Corpsmen are hardly ever able to get any medical training or take care of Navy requirements.
Here's the deal about the Reservists.. and you should start seeing the change now with the NPSB (NON-PROR SERVICE BASIC) program. The old way, they were taking People form the Civ community who were already trained as either a EMT/ LAB/ X-RAY or what have you.. the Navy thought it was a good way to save money.. What they lost sight of though were these few things that build a Sailor FMF DOC:1. No Boot-Camp Experience.. Say what you want.. It starts the military mentality...everyone should experience it.. It also teaches your chain of command and customs etc..2. Corpsman are not only Tech's / EMT's / Or Admin Weenies.. We do it all.. If you come in as a EMT I promise you, it will be hard doing the job of S/C or just ordering supplies.. etc.. They need the CORPS-School Experience as well as the Full FMSS course.. Understand even the A/D don't know anything and are green behind the ears after these 2 courses.. It is vital they train when they get the chance, I know it is hard on Drill weekend, I did the I&I thing, but the paradigm shift is occuring now.. The New way.. NPSB, They go to Boot-Camp, Then HM'A" School, then FMSS then out to a program-9 unit if one is availible..Another thing, Some of the HM's who have been in for a while and did not go to "A" School are doing so now.. They are sucking it up and coming through the full 14 week course as a "HN/HM3/HM2 and even saw a HM1" you talk about swallowing your pride to do what is right?? Trust me the Reserves feel your pain.. I hear it when I talk to them in school, They want to train. This is a "LEADERSHIP" issue.
Ahh Good Discussion.. Let's keep it up.. Thanks all!

Da-Chief..

[doc_rueda]

Hello all,

A new member and would like to say thanks to Da-cheif, for putting something out like this.

I've been in now for 5yrs and counting. In with 2nd HQ BN 2ND MARDIV. Been in a combat deployment with 1/8 in 2004-05. Was assigned to a CAP platoon in the Haditha Police Station and then to a MAP platoon during the push through Fallujah in Nov 04. Its one deployment I will never forget... Im trying to get out of here and get on the 1yr deployment with HQ back to Fallujah. I just turned down my PCS orders back home to Ingleside, TX so that I can go. Also, it will be a great time to have my separation from my wife done. lol. But i will be away from my 3 boys so don't think i'm leaving just because.

I would like to say more but it seems you all covered pretty much everything. The more you sweat in trainning , the less you bleed in combat. And thats mental and physical trainning. Be focused and ready shipmates.

[DocHoop]

[DocHoop]

"TheSurgicalTech" quit hiding behind your "C" school. Unlike most, I DON'T respect your opinion. Quit giving thatLAME excuse that your recruiter didn't tell you. Most of the recruits I pick up in my ambulance tell me that. What did you expect?You joined the Navy, not the freakin peace corps. Not everyone is of your opinion so don't act like weare. No onesaid anythingoffensive about Techs, but here you are on the defensive. How do you expect to advance without diversity in your duties? Clearly you are openly cowardice towards deploying. I'd choose PFC JoeSchmuckatelly over you anyday. You should gosomewhere and thrash yourself. Learn about the FMF before you knock it. Learn about anything yousign up for before jumpingfor that matter. Now give me an Oorah for that, dooshbag.

[DocHoop]

I want to point out to all of you that there are Corpsman such as myself, that have deployed 3 and 4 times to Iraq. We are worn out butwe suck it up. Most of us move on to our next shore duty station.Where you would expect we would be allowed to decompress. Yet,here comes along taskers for more 8404's. And becausetechs, boots, and whoever else duck and dodge these billets, those who have already been there deploy once again.

With that said,things are getting better. The sea/shore rotations changed.And Once I returned from deployment my Chief said there was new instruction out there guidliningthat once youAugmentout once at a shore command you will not be sent out again until all those are who haven't deployed do at least one. So progress is being made.

[Da-Chief]

That instruction though can be bended to meet the missions needs.

Look if they need you they are gonna pull ya. .Hands down..

But I agree 110% with what you said about TECH's etc.. I don't know when we got in the habbit "ASKING" what people thoght when delivering a order. Ask after you have accomplished such order as long as it is legal.

TRUST me most if not all orders are legal when given due to the nature of the UCMJ.. If I tell you to keep climbing a wall until you get up it.. As long as your safe.. you better keep climbing..

I am sick and tired of the "PUSSY-FI-CATION" of our NAVY..

We are a $)(%*$)((*) ARMED FORCE DAMNIT.. Let's start acting like one..

WHERE's MY COFFEE!!!!

;-)
Da-Chief.

[Da-Chief]

And If I offended anyone on the last post..

Go see the Air Force for a "GROUP-HUG"..

;-)
Da-Chief.

[doc_rueda]

Its trucked up that there are those trying to skate their way out of the service while there are those who put their ass on the line. Some try to get momma for help or get some POG as jobs to avoid the enemy. Already they merged the DT- HM rating. Hopefully, one day all "tech" jobs will be replaced by civilians. Then units can finally meet their t/o and not rely on MAPs who come in with no goddamn military bearing. That shit is fixed right away though.

i remember always hearing ,,, " i'm going to a "c" school so I won't go to war." Or "they won't take me because I'm a Lab tech. They don't need us." hahaha!! Wrong sucka! Like it was said ..YOU ARE A SAILOR 1st!!

Don't be pussies and buck up! Complacency kills...

[randver]

first off stop hating on techs just because we where smart enough to get a skill we can use when we get out. most of the OR techs I know are trying to get over to Iraq. and I know a bunch of guys in Div that are trying to do everything they can to get out of having to go to Iraq so its not just the techs that don’t want to go. plus most of the techs I know that don’t want to go are ones that already went with Div and got a "c" school with the hopes that they would not have to go back. and if all the tech jobs go to civs then you would have on one in group over there to keep you and your guys sorry butts alive when you get shot or blown the F up.

HM2 (FMF) WHITE

[Da-Chief]

HM2 White,

Don't take this personal..

Div HM's are pulling 2-3 tours in a 1 hitch with the FMF. I can tell you by walking the halls in any hospital that there are Pleanty of TECH"s who have not volunteered to go nor will do so.

Yeah the Div or Group HM's try to get out of it as they have already been over there a few times. Also what Tech's are up front riding in the Humvee's? How many medevac's have they done? Guess who brings you your patients? Sure as hell isn't the lab/X-ray/AVT/PMT(Well sometimes, they are forward) / Surgical tech's..

Truth hurts sometimes.. but I have had to fill out a mainfest to send people over.. Trust me the Tech's don't go unless spefically asked for..

8404/0000's just go..

Seriously though dude, If you aren't that way good onya.. Get some of your compatriots to have your backbone..

Chief out..

[randver]

Da-Chief wrote: HM2 White,

Don't take this personal.. Taking this personal because I was with Div from 00-03 in which time I did 3 deployments and then surg tech school then to NMCSD Balboa (shore duty)from 03-pres. since getting here I have deployed on the TAH 19 (Mercy) to Indonesia and to Ramadi Iraq I have probably spent a little over 2.5 yrs with my family in the last 6 yrs

Div HM's are pulling 2-3 tours in a 1 hitch with the FMF. I can tell you by walking the halls in any hospital that there are Pleanty of TECH"s who have not volunteered to go nor will do so. Tech's with group have to go 2-3 times per hitch too. andpeople like me that left Div and are on are shore time still get pulled to go too so its not just div guys

Yeah the Div or Group HM's try to get out of it as they have already been over there a few times. Also what Tech's are up front riding in the Humvee's? How many medevac's have they done? Guess who brings you your patients? Sure as hell isn't the lab/X-ray/AVT/PMT(Well sometimes, they are forward) / Surgical tech's.. 2 of my good friends both surg techs where just over there one did medevacs and the other was with EOD

Truth hurts sometimes.. but I have had to fill out a mainfest to send people over.. Trust me the Tech's don't go unless spefically asked for.. its not that the techs wont go its that are chain of command will not let us go unless a tech is asked for. so if its an 8404/0000 billet are chain of command will not let us go. the other problem is only males can go with Div.8404/0000's just go..because that’s what Div asks for

Seriously though dude, If you aren't that way good onya.. Get some of your compatriots to have your backbone.. and just for the record any corpsman not willing to go at lest once to save his fellow brothers and sisters pisses me of

Chief out..

[Poolzer]

Da-Chief (view_user.php?id=1) wrote:
Truth hurts sometimes.. but I have had to fill out a mainfest to send people over.. Trust me the Tech's don't go unless spefically asked for..

8404/0000's just go..

Soooo untrue Chief, so untrue.

After just leaving NH Corpus Christi, which has the HIGHEST platform and deploying percentage of any shore based hospital in the Navy, every E1-O6 with the exception of the CMC, XO, CO and medically unable too, have deployed once, if not 3 times in their 3-4 years shore duty rotation. The O5 directorate head of our largest directorate was given 3 weeks notice he was being deployed, so that proved no one was untouchable outside those I’ve mentioned. It doesn’t matter if you're 8404 or 0000, doesn’t matter if you're a lab tech or a psych tech, you were/are deployed/deploying to div, group, wing or EMPs. They were not deployed to do their jobs especially if they have 8404 on their orders. The 2 other 8401 (SAR) HM's that deployed with me in 2004 both went to group, 1 worked in an STP, the other a convey HM of all things, and I got 8404/0000 in my CASEVAC group with no aviation training, no EMT training and 1 couldn’t inflate a NRB reservoir bag until shown how, he was a lab tech that hadn't done patient care in…6 years.

I was stationed at NH Corpus from Dec 03-July 06 and worked there a total of 6 1/2 months. I’m now looking forward to going to sea duty just so I can take a break from deploying to the sandlot....


Shore duty isn’t what it was 6 years ago...you will see more deployments than a typical sea duty billet.

[Da-Chief]

See that is where it is screwy, It used to be PENSACOLA that deployed the most.. I was told the bases that are under BRAC or are standing down are the ones getting nailed for Deployments.

As for TECH's.. I'll bet you if you and I had a spreadsheet in front of us, most if not all the people being pulled from these areas are 0000/8404's.. How do I know?? I worked the POMI office up until Nov 04.. Yeah things might have changed since then.. Hell I cannot believe it has been 2 years..

Hmmm..

All I know, I walk around GLAKES right now and the majority of HM's being pulled are Quad 0's or 8404's.. Repiratory yes but we have no need for them here anymore.. Psych tech's were deployed to CUBA but like I said we don't have a Psych ward anymore..

You know I am a 8404/8406 (Poolzer stop laughing) And I did my share of deploying..

Every year you can see who is not selected for HMC by who is finding out a way not to be deployed.. I can assure you there are still a fair number who are hiding in the cracks, or coming up with some illness when the name goes on the board...

Hey.. let's chat about it tomorrow night 2000-2200 CST..

;-)
Later

HMC

[Poolzer]

Yes, they all have their 8404, I judt wanted to comment that techs werent getting out of deploying as was mentioned earlier. Those that dont have their fmss go to emps in kuwait, those that do push north.

Wont be around for the chat, g/f is flying down from Seattle to spend a few days and try to wake me up from this tip of the spear c-school in week 6 learning all the joyous physical exams...maybe Ill get to do a practical this weekend....:P

Sorry, blacked out there for a few, dont know why.....back on track now!

[Da-Chief]

Just don't get your prostate rubbed..:shock:

;-)
Later

HMC

P.s have a great weekend.. P-Cola is awesome this time of year..:cool:

[TheSurgicalTech]

DocHoop wrote: "TheSurgicalTech" quit hiding behind your "C" school. Unlike most, I DON'T respect your opinion. Quit giving thatLAME excuse that your recruiter didn't tell you. Most of the recruits I pick up in my ambulance tell me that. What did you expect?You joined the Navy, not the freakin peace corps. Not everyone is of your opinion so don't act like weare. No onesaid anythingoffensive about Techs, but here you are on the defensive. How do you expect to advance without diversity in your duties? Clearly you are openly cowardice towards deploying. I'd choose PFC JoeSchmuckatelly over you anyday. You should gosomewhere and thrash yourself. Learn about the FMF before you knock it. Learn about anything yousign up for before jumpingfor that matter. Now give me an Oorah for that, dooshbag.

thanks for the kind words high charger... i don't know if you read in navy times that those freaking recruiters is costing the navy millions of $ in losses because of their inefficiencies and lies. a recruit that has been lied upon will find all reasons to get out of the navy... ( back pain.. knee pain... insanity... or worst will collect disability for their malingering illness) after spending thousands of $ in a recruit.

all you need to do is get in touch w/ reality. we all know that when the time to start picking someone for deployment the back pain incident is on the rise meaning not all have the same oooorah.. mentality as you have.

if from the start those recruiters only picked those dedicated and well informed recruits, there will be more volunteers for such billets and few drop outs from the navy. since the iraq war we see droves of sailors getting out and tell me i'm wrong.

[crazycajun]

Wow, seen some hard words among this topic.

My point of view, since being with the Marine Corps for the past 9 consecutive years. I've seen all kinds of people deploy, those with NEC other than 8404. I've seen PT techs deploy as 8404s, I've seen others drop their NECs to get to the FMF. I've seen all kinds of people get out after their Iraq deployment and I've seen them reenlist. I've also seen those at the hospitals volunteer for deployment when requesting a Basic NEC and they had an Advance NEC of the same. It takes all NECs to keep us going and remember Big Navy will be looking at deploying all people regardless of NECs in the future. I've seen other rates deploy to Iraq who would of never thoughtthey would be going (ie. Navy Divers working with Land Based EOD instead of underwater).

I've heard people say, "I didn't sign up for this, all I wanted was college money"! I say to them, then you shouldn't have signed up. Our place in this Navy is to deploy where we are needed, when we are needed to do the job we signed up to do. I've been to Iraq, not as many times as some and more times than others. I was due to go out again and was given a break. For this I'm greatful, though I was ready to go again because this is the job I signed up to do. My wife and children would have understood, though wouldn't have liked it. I've been po'd to see people who haven't deployed ever in their life, complain about being deployed once. My sea service ribbon doesn't need any more stars since I have a silver one and a bronze one on there already. Though I'm always ready to go and do what I'm supposed to do when the time arises. Just ask my wife and she'd tell you how I am.

I agree, I'm FRIST A SAILOR, I'm then a CORPSMAN, and then I'm a BUG-CHASER. I've deployed twice in billets that as a PMT I'd would have never dreamed of, in 2003 I was part of the Patient Evacuation Team (PET) for the unit I deployed with and in 2005 I sat inside the TACC assisting the Battle Captain for the Wing on missions involving Patient Movement from the Battle Field and to Higher Levels of Treatment. So, I've learned the aformentioned statement Sailor, Corpsman, Technician.

This is just my point of view. Keep doing what we are known best for, "Taking care of Marines and Sailors"!

Semper Fi, crazycajun

[Da-Chief]

Great post..

If I have a fault (Ok I have many) it is that I am a passionate person and sometimes my passion gets in the way of my communication skills.

HMC (CrazyCajun) Barling nailed it.

I too was a AVT and served as such for years, but I have also served with "ARTY" as well after I earned the AVT NEC years before. You wanna talk about a fish out of water? Air with the grunts?

I learned though that essentially we are all "1" team. There should be no, "US, THEM" etc.. I will serve where ever sent when ever sent.

I took it to heart that I would obey "ALL" orders given to me once I signed on the dotted line. Tell me to climb a wall and it won't hurt me, I will try till I pass out..

I'm just that way..


Do you think the Marines, Sailors who were storming the Mountains at Iwo Jima wanted to be there? Or how about "D"-day..

No one wants to pick a fight, but damnit I will defend and fight back when struck. And I will do what my Commander in Chief tell's me too as this is the oath I took. It is not my job to question his authority..

Ok rant over, I do want to say though I value "ALL" opnions even if they are not my own.. There should be a on-going dialogue but remember not to get hot, this is just discussion. This is what makes our Country the best in the world.
I just wish the others could taste the freedom we have..

Da-Chief out..

[popsie]

You know history repeats itself. When I was Active duty heard the same stuff just a different time and war. To the 8483. Back in the seventies if you weren't a 8404 before going to your school. You had a 95% chance you were going to be in the very near future. A majority didn't like it, but that was the reality of it. If you were a 8404 and put in for O.R. to get a break from the marines. You got a 26 week break when you became a 8483/8404 . You went back to the green side. In my class 8 graduated four of us were 8404's three went back to the corps and one went to the seabees. one went to Diego Garcia. The other three went to training commands. We went did our jobs. There was a saying back in my day. Never Again Volunteer Yourself. In a way once you signed the dotted line. You didn't have to. There was always a job do to. I was always assigned one. Bottom linedo your duty and when opertunity comes upto sign on that dotted line comes up. You're opertunity to say NO is there. When I was active Duty I did my job and did it well. If I didn't a few bad things could happen. 1) somebody else would have to do it. 2) Somebody could or would be hurt or killed. 3) I could be hurt and nobody would care. Now as a civilian I've practiced being a street Paramedic for over 26 years I still do the same job. I just don't have a recruiter to blame. I think what I 'm trying to say do your job, learn from it , down the road what you learned will help a lot. Hindsight is always 20/20.

[puckmedic]

I've been somewhat amused by this topic. I was a deployed AVT most of my career. I did have a shore duty followed by an overseas tour to finish it out to my twenty. However, I always have felt that the only good HM had a sea service ribbon or some other operational experience. With that said, after four med cruises, a tour with a MAG and enough short time dets to fill a sack full of experience, I can safely say that I was finally regarded by my peers as a good doc.

Proud to have been that, unlike some today who tend to sneak off and hide from anything that is too "inconvenient" like deploying. Heaven's forbid we should interupt the class schedule at the local community college so you can go do your job.

No NEC should be exluded from the deployment, there's folks been there four timeS. On the other side of the fence, an HN sits at a desk, moving records to the doctor's in box, chewing on a fat cookie and complaining.

Complaining how the LPO won't give him or her special liberty. Complaining about how he or she must stand duty one day for six hours every six days or so. Complaining about how a college class is taking up all their free time. Complaining about trivial stupid nothing crap.

I actually heard people say "I'm not going to a ship, I'm going to stay in the hospital/clinic pipeline and not get put someplace dangerous. At that moment, they were in the worst possible position-- Danger was right there. They were standing in front of me voicing that thought and I became very unglued!!! On more than one occasion, I rattled a few windows letting folks know where that put them with me.

Now, in my blue ID card happiness, with 8years , 8 months and 14 days left on my FLEET RESERVE time and being subject to recall , I still feel the same. If recalled, I'll go where ever. Just know that it better be to hand out tylenol at alocal clinic. If I go and I find out even one HM hasn't deployed, I'll return hunt them down and give them a six second head start!!!!

[DevilDoc]

Deploying, not deploying....bottom line is, we all signed our contract, we all took an oath to "defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic", etc etc. etc. So what kind of defending are you doing if you are an xray tech sitting in a cushy hospital, never going OCONUS for your entire career? If they opt to send you, it's because you are needed. It's not about you, it's about your buddy next to you. It's about being there to help out your friend. When the bullets start flying, I would hope that you would want to guy next to you to "want" to save your ass, and I would hope that you would want to save his. If they tell me to go, I am packing my bags and heading over, and I am there to take care of my Marines and the guy/gal next to me first. The rest is just trivial b.s. Welcome to the U.S. Military! My father did two tours in Nam, came back with his back blown wide open, has a spinal fusion to show for it, all because he was protecting the guy next to him. Be a "hero" not because it looks cool, but because it's the right thing to do! Is it fair to keep sending back the same guy 3-4 times, while you sit behind in safe territory, no chances of your life on the line? Is it fair that that one person risks himself over and over and over again, so you have the right to sit here and bitch about how you shouldn't go over? What if someone drops a bomb on your cushy little hospital? Now are you going to whine that you shouldn't have to be there to? Why did you join then? Why are you here? We don't need dead weight! Buck up! Do what your duty entails! That is defending your country and countrymen! I am so sick of hearing, "but the recruiter didn't tell me that". It's your responsibility to educate yourself! Everyone knows that once you sign the dotted line, your life is no longer your own, it belongs to Uncle Sam.

[DevilDoc]

Deploying, not deploying....bottom line is, we all signed our contract, we all took an oath to "defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic", etc etc. etc. So what kind of defending are you doing if you are an xray tech sitting in a cushy hospital, never going OCONUS for your entire career? If they opt to send you, it's because you are needed. It's not about you, it's about your buddy next to you. It's about being there to help out your friend. When the bullets start flying, I would hope that you would want to guy next to you to "want" to save your ass, and I would hope that you would want to save his. If they tell me to go, I am packing my bags and heading over, and I am there to take care of my Marines and the guy/gal next to me first. The rest is just trivial b.s. Welcome to the U.S. Military! My father did two tours in Nam, came back with his back blown wide open, has a spinal fusion to show for it, all because he was protecting the guy next to him. Be a "hero" not because it looks cool, but because it's the right thing to do! Is it fair to keep sending back the same guy 3-4 times, while you sit behind in safe territory, no chances of your life on the line? Is it fair that that one person risks himself over and over and over again, so you have the right to sit here and bitch about how you shouldn't go over? What if someone drops a bomb on your cushy little hospital? Now are you going to whine that you shouldn't have to be there to? Why did you join then? Why are you here? We don't need dead weight! Buck up! Do what your duty entails! That is defending your country and countrymen! I am so sick of hearing, "but the recruiter didn't tell me that". It's your responsibility to educate yourself! Everyone knows that once you sign the dotted line, your life is no longer your own, it belongs to Uncle Sam.

[DocHoop]

First off, I want to say I have nothing against techs. Thosepositions have to be manned asmuch as the Corpsmen out with the Marines. However I do have something against sailors who run and hide when called upon. TheSurgTech, your still on this "my recruiter shoud have told me" shiet. Get over it. The recruiter isNOT an all knowing being. He did his job, and that was to get youin. He may havenot told you everything, yetmy money is onhe didn't lie to you either.It doesn't take a rocket scientistnor a recruiter to know that whenjoining the military there is a chance you may go into combat.Wewould have less recruitsif we were to rely on your plan. Corps school already directs most of its malegraduates towards the MarineCorps involuntarily, and we are still undermanned. Are you under the assumption that there thousands of young men willing to lay it down forcountry? More than likely not. , but thats what we saidwhen we putour signature on the dotted line.Were you dozing off when you rose your right hand and stated theSailors creed?Why don't you man up and take some accountability for your actions instead of blaming others your whole life.Yeah, I've known Sailors to give themself an injury priorto deployment. I knew a Doc who broke both his ankles in a motorcycle accident to get out of going. The difference between me and you isyou defend these pricks,saying that the system creates them. I say its the individuals themselves that arethe problem. If they'dface their fear, and man up this wouldn't be an issue. You b*tch andcomplain throughout your statements, yet I don't hearhow you would resolve this? Get off your recruiter bandwagon. He provides a valuble asset to the Navy but he doesn't have that much power in the fleet.

[DocCollins]

TheSurgicalTech wrote: This is my real sentiment and I will not be hypocrite about this. If I knew from the very start that corpsman will servew/ theMarines, I would never, over my dead body enlisted in the Navy. I would maybe, but w/ a different rating.

I felt there was a deceptionfrom the very start. My recruiter never mentioned about FMSS, Marines...To my surprise I only learned the Marine things when I was already in A school. I was so pissed off. I NEVER JOINED THE NAVY TO BE A MARINE ORHAVE ANYTHINGTO DO W/ THEM.Cut that high charger, hurahhh thing.. we were just made to swallow those things because were already into it but I know majority are just afraid to say anything for fear of rejection or criticism.

I could serve my nation w/ same enthusiasm and dedication in the middle of the ocean. My only issue here is that I should have been informed from the very start about serving w/ the Marines as a corpsman. All could have been better if I were only given the information and the opportunity to signafter havingall the information I need to know.





I think the reason most recruiters don't say anything is because I think that the majority of the Navy has no real idea what a Corpsman does with the Marines. I show up on a carrier one day in digital cammies to help them do some Post Deployment Health Assesments and I kept getting the question, "Why is a Navy guy wearing that uniform?" The blue navy is mostly unaware of the all the roles a Corpsman fills. If you read the Navy Times we are constantly called HMSR, HMSA, and HMSN and I've not to this day ever seen it listed as such anywhere. I find it hard to blame a recruiter for not knowing about the greenside of life for Corpsman especially if your recruiter has spent a lot of time at sea or on submarines. I would also challenge you to read the contract you sign. I pulled my service record just to verify but it says quite clearly that a large percentage of HMs graduating from Basic Hospital Corps School will recieve follow on training a Field Medical Service School in either Camp Pendleton, California or Camp Lejuene, NC.

HM2 (FMF) Joseph Collins

[kamnjess]

I was under Chief Mullins for a brief moment in my navy life... I am now a corpsman of three years... He was one that will be with me through the end... There are chiefs, even E-5 and under that can stay with you the whole time you are in the service. He was one that helped me get through the tough times. He guided me through the hard and the good. But i can say that there was one that will stand out from the rest is HMC Degelder. I meet him in the fall of 04, Being new then to the navy he showed me hope for A leader and a father... being a women some times we need someone to fill some type of space in our lives.. But I thought no one cared no one knew me...But he took the time. Real corpsman will always be there for there fellow shipmates. Nothing can take the place of the passion we have for our patients... Maybe I am crazy but I didn’t pick this rate going in. Maybe cause it wasn’t offered or that I wasn’t at the right place or the right time when I joined... But I stand today being a single mother and facing all types of challenges. There has been a few that I have found that have cared more about me then the family I came from. HM1 Todd, HMCS Fletcher, HMC Perry, HMCS Johnson, HMC DEAN, Master Chief Ronellet(please excuse me if I spelt that one wrong). These are names of people who looked beyond my struggles and saw me for me.. I say this with pride we love the ones who love us… They makes us who we are…I love then for making me better in every way…..Please corpsman out there make sure that you take from every leader you have and make the best,,, But know that some day no matter where you are or what kinda station you will be at that you make the best for your people.. REMEMBER YOUR PAIN…TO FEEL THEIRS... That IS THE KEY

[DocCollins]

HMCS Fletcher. Is he a sorta tall white guy white a shaved head that is a recon corpsman and has a funny voice because he was hit in the throat with a surfboard when he was like 12 or something?

[Da-Chief]

HMCS Fletcher was a Pharmacy tech then went to SUB IDC School. Was working at the old Naval Hospital Great Lakes, Now works as the SEL for Clinicals div here at NHCS.

V/R
HMC

[HM3_JD]

I guess I was lucky with my recruiter. First, I had a co-worker who had been an HM (sucker went off and got his commission with the USAF as an RN... dork!) who told me about the NPS program, which got me interested (I had tried for Army WOCS Flight Program, but had been shot down due to hearing). So, went down to the Baltimore recruiting station, and was lucky enough to get HM2 (FMF) Domingo as my recruiter. He and I talked a bit, then I went back to work. Then I got another bit of good fortune, and found out that an HM3 (FMF) was starting on our team at work. So, talked to them, and found out about what Corpsmen do, and went back, talked with my recruiter some more, and signed on the dotted line. So, I guess I was able to get a good recruiter that knew the program, and wasn't misled at all during the process. Hopefully once my knee injury gets fixed (darn civilian job...) I'll be able to sign for FMSS.
If anyone is at IDC school with HM2 Domingo, tell him HM3 Davey says hi.

[bjpete]

I'm sitting on the sidelines now, as I retired 2 years ago, but am proud that I served as an HM for 26 years, 5 on active duty and the rest as a reservist. I am so thankful that there are so many dedicated young sailors who have assumed the ranks as HMs now that I've retired. I do pray for the troops often, and am saddened to read when one of my fellow "docs" has fallen. If I may be so bold though, I always must remember that the main purpose of the US military is to "kill people and break things". If any one does want to whine and cry about what happens because of the armed forces, then please just save it for OPRAH.

I try not to talk too much about politics but when John Kerry opened his mouth with his supposed joke, I was insulted, not just for myself, but for everyone in uniform. I Know I'm preaching to the choir, but all of those who are serving are the finest and bravest this country has and we owe them so much. This country is so blessed to have our all volunteer military, and also to have our DOCs who are willing to risk it all to keep the wounded alive so they can return home. Thank you so much for your service,
Semper FI.

[Da-Chief]

Your Right up the road from us here..
Madison?

Da-Chief

[AndiRRT]

Deploying, not deploying....bottom line is, we all signed our contract, we all took an oath to "defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic", etc etc. etc. So what kind of defending are you doing if you are an xray tech sitting in a cushy hospital, never going OCONUS for your entire career? If they opt to send you, it's because you are needed. It's not about you, it's about your buddy next to you. It's about being there to help out your friend. When the bullets start flying, I would hope that you would want to guy next to you to "want" to save your ass, and I would hope that you would want to save his. If they tell me to go, I am packing my bags and heading over, and I am there to take care of my Marines and the guy/gal next to me first. The rest is just trivial b.s. Welcome to the U.S. Military! My father did two tours in Nam, came back with his back blown wide open, has a spinal fusion to show for it, all because he was protecting the guy next to him. Be a "hero" not because it looks cool, but because it's the right thing to do! Is it fair to keep sending back the same guy 3-4 times, while you sit behind in safe territory, no chances of your life on the line? Is it fair that that one person risks himself over and over and over again, so you have the right to sit here and bitch about how you shouldn't go over? What if someone drops a bomb on your cushy little hospital? Now are you going to whine that you shouldn't have to be there to? Why did you join then? Why are you here? We don't need dead weight! Buck up! Do what your duty entails! That is defending your country and countrymen! I am so sick of hearing, "but the recruiter didn't tell me that". It's your responsibility to educate yourself! Everyone knows that once you sign the dotted line, your life is no longer your own, it belongs to Uncle Sam.


I don't feel like I have the right to say anything here because I am the newbie, and am not yet in the Navy. However, as a healthcare provider that is facing this goal, I would like to respectfully say that whether I am in combat or on a ship, I will still be leaving behind a husband and young son to care for our men and women. Quite honestly, aside from the chance to train and use the best equipt. and facilities, and the personal reward of knowing you have used your training to care fro American heroes, I am also nudged in this direction by the programs the Navy has in place to put me through 200K worth of medical education. The clencher is that I realize I am not gonna get something for nothing. My education dollars must be earned somehow, and if the Navy deems appropriate to place me in harm's way then that is what will happen, and I will suck it up and go. When choosing this way of reaching a goal, I have decided that is the worth the risk.

[Da-Chief]

AndiRRT

"Uhhh-RAH"

HMC

[citrus]

Andi sounds like a Squared away Sailor already

[DeeDee]

Andi
Sounds like you got your head screwed on straight - way to go lady

DeeDee

[AM2]

sorry about continuing to drag up old posts but i'm new here and you guys have alot of interesting discussions going on. my two cents on this is that yes we all have a responsibility to serve where the navy deems best for our countrys defense. yes we all signed a contract. and yes we all are here to do our part. the thing is the navy also needs to take responsibility. they have a responsibility to inform new recruits of the changes being implemented. not just having recruiters play off there limited knowledge and act as "salesmen". in our modern society how hard is it to communicate these changes to the recruiters. there should be some sort of website for every job and school in the navy just like this one. where instructors can answers recruiters about what the recruits can really expect. it's very hard to find up to date information about anything in the navy online. i know because i researched corpsman for my wife for two months before i was finally convinced she would not be sent greenside and let her join. i never once came across this website in two months. the day she found out she got fmf orders i found it. now we have all the information we ever could have needed to make an intellegent decision but the mistake was already made. we are both willing to accept that and carry out both of our obligations to the military but it shouldn't be us settling or just "accepting" a mistake. it should have been our choice. i am beating this dead horse to try get get the point across......and if cheif really does get the MCPON to read this i would like him to know one thing.
RECRUITING OFFICES NEED TO BE MORE INFORMED

with all the changes in the new navy noone knows what is going on anymore including the people making the rules. its hard for someone to use the navy to better themselves if they are signing up for one thing and doing something completly different. i don't think you will have a problem finding anyone to do any job. especially greenside corpsman. i see these forums flooded with people who love it and would kill to get in. hell i'm even thinking of trying to crossrate after reading chiefs website. thats the thing though. the one thing that makes us america. the thing that makes us free. Choice. if your screwing people out of there choice through litteral B/S, your no better than the terrorists because you are robbing our youths of there lives and there choice. if your gonna do that just let it be known ahead of time to everyone. you have no choice. you are just here to fill a billet. we don't give a crap about your future now sign on the dotted line. atleast then they have a choice.

[AndiRRT]

AndiRRT

"Uhhh-RAH"

HMC

Andi sounds like a Squared away Sailor already

Andi
Sounds like you got your head screwed on straight - way to go lady

DeeDee



Wow, Thanks guys, but it is just how I think. It's really quite simple. In a country where there are so many options to qualify for college dollars (i.e. Pell Grants, scholarships, loans, whatever), there are other ways for me to do this.If you don't want to serve your country how your Country sees fit, then DON'T USE THE NAVY AS A WAY TO PAY FOR YOUR EDUCATION! When I do it this way, and I end up in a hospital that gets bombed, I can't blame the Navy or Army or Marine Corps. I CHOSE this route. On that same note, I can't whine or cry when I get deployed. I am joining the Navy. I AM GONNA GET DEPLOYED. I know this, and to me, it is worth it. My husband knows that when he is supporting my decision to do things this way, he is agreeing to lose his wife for possibly months or even years at a time. I have gotten a lot of conflicting info from recruiters, but some of this is common sense and doesn't require a signed document to verify.



Andi